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Visitor
Kassus
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎03-31-2011

Complaints about NSS/NIS

OK, before I give any of my complaints I would like to say something.  For many years I was an avid Norton usewr and supporter, that all changed when Norton DESTROYED two, count them , TWO Hard Drives in two seperate XP systems(this was back in 04).  Now before you say this was caused by User error, both systems wer D/C from the internet, and had fresh installs of Windows, Norton itself was installed from a VALID NORTON CD.  When norton installed it requested a restart, upon restart the computers stated the ther WERE NO IDE DRIVES INSTALLED, and upon later testing it was found that the drives themselves had been destroyed.

 

Now that that is out of the way.

 

My complaints:

 

1. The users inability to set things to be automatic.

2. The CONFLICTS caused by Norton when the user installs an AV program other than Norton.

3. The CONFLICTS caused by Norton when the user attempts to use third party programs(eg, CCleaner, HJT, Spybot)

4. The Users inability to DISABLE Norton startup when it causes problems

5. The INEFFECTIVENESS of Norton to PREVENT and LOCATE problems(eg. a KNOWN virus was scanned by Norton, AVG Free, and PIS.  It WAS NOT detected by Norton)

 

As a Technician I know how to DISABLE Norton from Windows startup, but I WILL NOT publicly give out the information, as it is MY INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY.

 

I am not attempting to be anything but nice, in my own way of course.  If anyone has any rebuttle for any of what I have said It is welcom.  As is ANY known and working solution to any of my complaints.

Visitor
Kassus
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎03-31-2011

Re: Complaints about NSS/NIS

I would like to add one more compaint to the list.

 

6. The fact that Norton essentially TAKES OVER a users system.(eg. even in SAFE MODE, norton still forces Window to allow it to run)

Bot Obliterator
Quads
Posts: 13,241
Registered: ‎07-21-2008

Re: Complaints about NSS/NIS

 


Kassus wrote:

OK, before I give any of my complaints I would like to say something.  For many years I was an avid Norton usewr and supporter, that all changed when Norton DESTROYED two, count them , TWO Hard Drives in two seperate XP systems(this was back in 04).  Now before you say this was caused by User error, both systems wer D/C from the internet, and had fresh installs of Windows, Norton itself was installed from a VALID NORTON CD.  When norton installed it requested a restart, upon restart the computers stated the ther WERE NO IDE DRIVES INSTALLED, and upon later testing it was found that the drives themselves had been destroyed.

 

Now that that is out of the way.

 

My complaints:

 

1. The users inability to set things to be automatic.

2. The CONFLICTS caused by Norton when the user installs an AV program other than Norton.  

That is the way it is suppose to be 2 AV programs are to be installed at the same time for a hand full of reasons, All Security program vendors and good technicians been trained know that and why.

 

3. The CONFLICTS caused by Norton when the user attempts to use third party programs(eg, CCleaner, HJT, Spybot)

There is no conflict with Norton with CCleaner and HJT (Hijackthis) If you are meaning HJT shows Norton / Symantec in the list, as a Service, BHO etc.  It's suppose to.

Spybot S&D in realtime with Norton and Spybot with it's Teatimer Module is not a good idea as discussed prevoiusly on the Forum. (2 realtime Products) Spybot also interfers with other more advanced tools I have.


4. The Users inability to DISABLE Norton startup when it causes problems

5. The INEFFECTIVENESS of Norton to PREVENT and LOCATE problems(eg. a KNOWN virus was scanned by Norton, AVG Free, and PIS.  It WAS NOT detected by Norton)

 

As a Technician I know how to DISABLE Norton from Windows startup, but I WILL NOT publicly give out the information, as it is MY INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY.

 

I am not attempting to be anything but nice, in my own way of course.  If anyone has any rebuttle for any of what I have said It is welcom.  As is ANY known and working solution to any of my complaints.


Quads

 

Visitor
Kassus
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎03-31-2011

Re: Complaints about NSS/NIS

2. The CONFLICTS caused by Norton when the user installs an AV program other than Norton.  

That is the way it is suppose to be 2 AV programs are to be installed at the same time for a hand full of reasons, All Security program vendors and good technicians been trained know that and why.

On, MY system, I run 2 AV programs.  PIS(Panda) and AVG, and I have NEVER had any conflicts between the 2.  Also, I have seen other systems with several AV programs installed, and Norton is the FIrst that I have seen cause a problem when more than one AV program is installed.

 

3. The CONFLICTS caused by Norton when the user attempts to use third party programs(eg, CCleaner, HJT, Spybot)

There is no conflict with Norton with CCleaner and HJT (Hijackthis) If you are meaning HJT shows Norton / Symantec in the list, as a Service, BHO etc.  It's suppose to.

Spybot S&D in realtime with Norton and Spybot with it's Teatimer Module is not a good idea as discussed prevoiusly on the Forum. (2 realtime Products) Spybot also interfers with other more advanced tools I have.

Norton is picking up CCleaner and HJT as malware.  Spybot will NOT run at all.  However, I can understnd the Teatimer Module conflicting.

Bot Obliterator
Quads
Posts: 13,241
Registered: ‎07-21-2008

Re: Complaints about NSS/NIS

All Major AV vendors know an alot of the time around the web state Not to have more than 1 security product installed at one time. I have known for years, and so do so many every day users.

It's is your choice to have AVG and Panda Internet Security installed at the same time, but that means your complaint about Norton conflicting is not Nortons fault as you have other realtime AV's installed.

 

I have no problem running HJT or CCleaner,  the last time I tried Spybot S&D 1.6 as On demand I had no problem either, But then again I only had Norton installed no other AV's from Avast, AVG, Bitdefender, Kaspersky, Panda, McAfee, Trend Micro.....................

Your problem then is more than likely, easy to see with what shouldn't be done.

 

To me all complaint about Norton are null and void, due to what you have done above.

 

Quads

Visitor
Kassus
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎03-31-2011

Re: Complaints about NSS/NIS

I am complaining due to a CUSTOMERS computer.

SendOfJive
Posts: 9,884
Kudos: 4,184
Solutions: 706
Registered: ‎02-07-2009

Re: Complaints about NSS/NIS

[ Edited ]

Hi Kassus,

 

I have to agree with Quads that running multiple AV programs is not recommended, and that some of your complaints may be due to the consequences of having this configuration.  It even raises my curiousitly about the destroyed hard drives, should you have been installing Norton onto a machine that already had other security software.  Changes to the Windows kernel made by a newly installing AV program could certainly be mistaken as the work of a virus by a resident AV program.  The resulting battle could have caused some major issues, for sure.  I once read an article where the author attempted this as an experiment and the results were not pretty - the hard drive was not destroyed, but it was a nice day if you like blue screens.

huwyngr
Posts: 18,959
Topics: 906
Kudos: 2,329
Solutions: 337
Registered: ‎04-13-2008

Re: Complaints about NSS/NIS

I have been using CCleaner on my computers for generations of NIS and N360 (I multiboot and I have had several desktops and laptops over the years) and I have never had any problems and certainly no warnings from Norton about CCleaner.

 

When you refer to Complaints about NSS/NIS as your topic could you please be a little more specific -- The only NSS I can think of is Norton Security Suite which may be the COMCAST modified version of Norton 360 -- since this contains elements that overlap with CCleaner it might be identified as a conflict but I don't get that with Norton 360.

Could you clarify and give the version numbers or at least the years since the performance, tailorabiltiy/tweakability and impact vary over the versions and the improvements over the years is very noticeable.

 



Hugh
Visitor
Kassus
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎03-31-2011

Re: Complaints about NSS/NIS

[ Edited ]

I only have a min, so, its the NSS that come from Comcast.  When I have the time I will check the version numbers

Regular Contributor
Kelly
Posts: 138
Registered: ‎11-19-2008

Re: Complaints about NSS/NIS

Interesting post.

 

Don't know what to make of the hard drive errors you had back in the day.  I've seen it happen where this error cropped up on restart after a clean install of Windows using imaged software (as IT folks are wont to do) - the result often due to missing or corrupted device drivers (namely the IDE controller) on the imaged copy.  Normally not a problem if the OS and device drivers are up to date before adding application and/or security software on top of it from what I've seen.  Too far back and too many variables to say for sure, but I think the OS would be the more likely culprit.

 

Other comments keyed to the succeeding paragraph:

 

1.  There's a spate of automatic set-and-forget features with NIS, making it probably one of the most boring pieces of software I've ever used.  I check things, run live update manually, run an occasion scan just so I feel like I'm contributing somehow.

 

2.  As others have pointed out, for a host of reasons realtime AV software doesn't play well together.  At all. 

 

3.  I've never had a problem with NIS and third party software.  My computer and internet habits probably account for this.  I keep the OS, browsers, AV suite (NIS), and applications up to date and do the occasional tune-up.  Hence since I tend to stay out of bad neighborhoods on the net (includes social networking sites), I rarely have the need for third party malware clean-up tools - unless it's cleaning up after some hapless friends and relatives who get infected with malware. (You know the type, the ones who never update their OS, and they still have Adobe Reader v.6 on their machines.)

 

4.  Norton start-up can be disabled, but I can't see why anyone would want to do it.  If it's that serious, then uninstall it completely and work from there I say.

 

5.  The ineffectiveness (as state it) of NIS to find malware..........in recent reviews from publications like PC World, I note with interest that no AV software in testing picked up 100 per cent of malware samples thrown at it.  Particularly noteworthy here is the reference to multiple realtime AV programs installed on the same machine.  If the customer referred to at the bottom of the thread is of the mind that if one AV suite is good, having several is better and between them all it will catch anything, the thinking is fundamentally flawed.  As already stated, multiple realtime AV programs on the same machine is a recipe for a whole lot of things that keep the Geek Squad at Best Buy (among others) in business.  The way I look at it, there is no vendor out there that can zero defect manage the malware world - a few people have to get hit with it before anyone even realizes something new is out there. 

 

How to disable Norton from Windows start-up is not a craftily guarded industry secret, and there's more than one way to do it.  I went offline and disabled NIS a couple years back because it seemed to be causing problems rendering video in Studio v. 10.  it was a workaround, but once Pinnacle put out the patch (for a range of issues) it was an unnecessary step.  But as I mentioned earlier, I've found no reason to disable it over the past several years.  If it's because of conflict with other AV and security software, then either remove it first or remove Norton entirely before installing others. 

 

To come full circle, my recommended solution is to pick one realtime AV program (or security suite), remove entirely any other programs, and stick with it.