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Kudos18 Stats

Retaining your Local Vault

The process that follows is fairly straight forward and is one that we use during Norton product beta testing. It contains the instructions for manually importing an existing Local Vault into a fresh Norton product install without the need for installing a Norton 2012 product first. The prerequisite is that you have an existing Local Vault already saved somewhere first e.g. on your current PC, on another PC or in a backup image.

Normally, when considering a fresh install of a current Norton product, users who wish to retain their Local Vault would typically need to install a Norton 2012 product first so that they can create a Local Vault container for use during the 'in-place upgrade' process to a newer Norton product version. If they already have Local Vault files present from a previous installation, then they do not need to do this. They can simply import the existing Local Vault files into their new product install and their new Norton product will look after the rest. To be clear, this procedure does not modify the Norton product in any way eg. no registry changes, etc. The procedure below simply tricks the newly installed Norton product into thinking that there is existing user data present from a previous install.

Given the above, Local Vault creation is now possible for other users on the PC in question by simply creating an empty/deleted contents version of the Local Vault, IDDStor2.dat file, for their use.

Special thanks to Norton Community members PRIOR and PhoneMan for volunteering to test the following Local Vault restoration procedure during the recent Norton Security beta testing.


On the PC with a Local Vault:

  1. In Windows Explorer, make sure that the ‘Show hidden files and folders’ option is selected.
  2. Navigate to following folder: C:\ProgramData\Norton\{0C55C096-0F1D-4F28-AAA2-85EF591126E7}\NIS_21.1.1.7\IdentitySafeDataStore\S-1-5-21-1596595386-3307766018-3340439378-1000. Note that some components of the path above will be system dependent eg product version number and the last folder in the path. Each user on the system will have their own folder with a -100n suffix (eg -1000 above). You need to select folder that contains your local vault (usually denoted with a padlock overlay on the folder icon) or you can check the Security property of the folder to see if your user id has full control over the folder.
  3. In the folder above, copy the following three items to a USB drive or network location:

    bcd9d034b0734a60b5e46159d5a75b01
    IDDStor2.dat
    IDDStor2.dat.bak

    The first item in the list above is a folder containing favicons for your vault logins. Your folder may have a different name to the one above. From a technical standpoint, you really only need the IDDStor2.dat file to create a local vault on the target machine. Your Norton product will recreate the favicon folder if it is not present.

On the PC without a Local Vault:

  1. Disable Norton Product Tamper Protection temporarily.
  2. In Windows Explorer, make sure that the ‘Show hidden files and folders’ option is selected.
  3. Navigate to following folder: C:\ProgramData\Norton\{0C55C096-0F1D-4F28-AAA2-85EF591126E7}\NIS_21.1.1.7\IdentitySafeDataStore\S-1-5-21-1596595386-3307766018-3340439378-1000. Note that some components of the path above will be system dependent eg product version number and the last folder in the path. Each user on the system will have their own folder with a -100n suffix (eg -1000 above). You need to select your folder (usually denoted with a padlock overlay on the folder icon) or you can check the Security property of the folder to see if your user id has full control over the folder.
  4. In the folder above, paste the following three items that you saved earlier from the USB drive or network location:

    bcd9d034b0734a60b5e46159d5a75b01
    IDDStor2.dat
    IDDStor2.dat.bak
  5. Re-enable Norton Product Tamper Protection.
  6. Important - Log off the user account and log back on again.
  7. The local vault option should now be available for you to use. If you have a cloud vault associated with this user account, then remember to use your local vault password to log in to the local vault.

Replies

Kudos3 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Nice elsewhere! Another well made research....
So it seems Norton products just took out the interface, leaving all rest with respect to ID Safe local vault intact.

Its a relief for a lot of people who use windows 8.1 or later and others who like a less pained solution to retain local vault over clean installs.....
Kudos to you... And thanks to phoneman and prior...


The only bad deal for this method as I see is you need a set of files that already exists. So, I have a doubt, is it possible to create a generic blank vault with username : test password : test and share it with others? Will we be able to change the username and password later to one we like?
regards, CV | There is no ONE TOUCH KEY to security . Be alert and vigilant. . | Always have a Backup Plan!
Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

HI elsewhere THANKS for the info... ALF

Kudos3 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Creating an empty vault and changing the password should not be a problem. I will be looking into doing it very shortly and post my results although the Christmas holidays will take me out of pocket.

I know NIS has an option to change the vault password so that is not a problem. I don't have a "cloud" vault so after creating this empty local vault I am not sure the exact steps to migrate the logins from cloud to local.

I have transferred my NIS local vault to a clean install of Windows 8.1 and clean install of NS. At least this is a step forward and as long as Norton doesn't change their software we should be good to go.

Jim

Kudos6 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

First of all thanks  elsewhere, Prior and Phoneman (I guess this is the "backdoor" you were referring to) for your efforts in developing and testing this procedure.

I wish I had this info a week ago, as I just reverted my NIS v 21 back to NIS 2012 in order to regain my Local Vault and then over the topped to NSBU so I could regain my Local Vault that I did not have on this newer Win 7 system.  It would have been a good test for the procedure.

I do believe it will work for those who have another system with a Local Vault, but I feel the following may help some users if they need to reclaim their Local Vault ID Safe Data on their own systems that have a Local Vault.

When we were having problems with Comcast's Norton Security Suite not retaining ID safe Data, or a user "losing their data" for various reasons and not having done an Export, we used the following procedure to reclaim the data from their own HDDS.

The following is the macro I used:

"Since we are not aware of your operating system, I'll provide dual locations for your attempt to retrieve the logins.

Please be advised the numbers behind the N 360_ may be slightly different. Also the S-1-5-21 is a random generated number and the ending of it may be different from what I have shown below.

Also, please make sure you are logged out of your Vault before copying the folder to the new folder location. If you do not log out - the information you seek cannot be copied and it will throw an error.

Conversely, when you try to Import, you must be logged into the Vault in order to see the Import function.

XP:

C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Norton\{0C55C096-0F1D-4F28-AAA2-85EF591126E7}\N360_20.1.0.24\IdentitySafeDataStore


In Vista/Win 7:

C:\ProgramData\Norton\{0C55C096-0F1D-4F28-AAA2-85EF591126E7}\N360_20.1.0.24\IdentitySafeDataStore\S-1-5-21-1845553030-3031872880-4008053321-1001\

The Program Data Folder may be hidden in windows 7. so first choose Computer -> organize -> folder and search options -> view -> show hidden files and folders -> apply

1. Copy the IdentitySafeDataStore folder to a new folder in a convenient location on your computer. 
2. In the Identity Safe Settings Window select Import Data > Configure [+]
3. In the Import Identity Safe Data window, 'Browse' to the new folder you just created in step 1
4. Double click the folder to open it and select the file IDDStore2 > Open.
5 .Under 'While importing data', select 'Merge with existing data' and click OK. You may be prompted to enter the password for the old data.
6. If you have changed any login credentials for a particular site since the older data was created, you will be presented with a Data Conflict window. Select which login version you wish to keep and click OK.
7. OK your way out and check that the merged logins have been added and are working.


Let us know how things work out."

This procedure is pretty much the same as listed above - except, it is a method of regaining your own Local ID Safe Data from your system that already had a Local Vault.

Once again KUDOS for the "non-reverting" procedure to obtain a Local Vault.
 

Kudos7 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Great work guys!

Of course this would not be needed if Symantec listened to their customers and returned the local vault. 

https://community.norton.com/en/forums/please-return-local-vault

A little bit of knowledge is... well a little bit of knowledge.
Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Krusty, I have more chance of cracking a date with Katy Perry !

Windows 10 Home X 64 Norton Security Premium Current
Kudos2 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

@ Thread

Just setup Local Vault for two Windows user accounts on new lappy with new NIS install. 
Had to run through instructions twice....but, that was a skipped step...my mistake.

Happy Holidays to ALL !
EDIT:  I did have the Online Vault for an hour.  I was able to Login only once.   Subsequent attempts ~ Time Outs.  I tried all the tricks posted to resolve Time Outs. 

Happy camper with Local.   Don't tell Norton.  

Kudos1 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Am so happy I found this thread as I had previously used the V6.0 method to keep my Local Vault on my Win 7 machine but, when I purchased a new Win 8.1 machine a week ago I thought I was stuck with the dreaded Cloud Vault which after a clean install and after a clean reinstall made it impossible to get into my Cloud Vault without a remove and reinstall due to timing out with the correct password.  What a pain in the you know what.

While I struggled to accurately follow the instructions and made my share of errors, I did learn a lot about getting permissions to change files that were locked and slowing down and following directions completely.  I now have my Local Vault back from my old Win 7 machine and am pleased as puncy.

Only one thing would make me happier is that if Norton would fix the problems with Norton 360 and the toolbar causing crashes of FireFox by simply clicking any dropdown in the tool bar or multiple password dropdown which I am convinced is a timing issue since everything works fine for varying amounts of time and then simply click and crash!!!  In Win 7 the dropdowns froze and in Win 8 Firefox crashes.  This has been a known issue for over a year and have posted crash reports and going to send them today to the Norton people.

Many Kudos to the developers of this fix that once I learned how, much easier and quicker than the old start with V6.0 and then update to the current version and that won't work in Win 8

Many many thanks,

Dave

Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Hello ALL:

Just a quick question about keeping my Local Vault on a NEW Install!

I have built a new system and am running Win 8.1 Pro 64 bit. I use NIS 2014 on 3 XP systems and want to retain my Local Vault from one of my XP systems. OK, so far, as the instructions in this thread are clear enough.

HOWEVER, on my new system, with NO Norton AV version installed yet there is, of course NO IDSafedatastore and of course no tamper proof setting as Norton is NOT installed yet.

So, I guess I am asking what to do to keep a local vault? Am I supposed to install NS on the new system, and somehow get a prompt to skip any vault? Does it ask about a cloud vault, and then let me say no. At that point I guess I can then find that location and put my XP vault files in there? Is that what I need to do?

Thank You

If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is!
Kudos6 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Install NS and then run updates until they are done.

DO NOT attempt to open the Vault.

Check your settings and turn OFF tamper protection and check to see if Identity Safe is ON (should be by default)

Copy the files, Log off/ Log on your Windows User account.

Then you can open the Vault and it should be there. It will probably prompt to move to Online Vault but don't.

Jim

Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Jim, thanks for the info.

I am trying to follow along here, just to be clear in my head - you stated "open the Vault  and it should be there".  Am I correct in thinking that you have to use the Local Vault password that you used on the files that were copied to this new install?

Please a quick yes or no for my knowledge, by copying the files into this new install that is really what sets up the Local Vault in lieu of going thru the "Create Vault routine".

TIA for the info!

Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

I am glad I opened this topic again as I need to install on a clean system. I will give this a try!

Regarding this...

Copy the files, Log off/ Log on your Windows User account.

Copy files from Old system and log off what. I would copy files with a file manager not NIS or NS. Then Log on to my Windows User Account...at Norton?

Sorry for being so "thick"...:-)

If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is!
Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

MPSAN:

I am glad I opened this topic again as I need to install on a clean system. I will give this a try!

Regarding this...

Copy the files, Log off/ Log on your Windows User account.

Copy files from Old system and log off what. I would copy files with a file manager not NIS or NS. Then Log on to my Windows User Account...at Norton?

Sorry for being so "thick"...:-)

In order to access Norton and your directory.  You log into your Windows user account on old and new.   Copy files from directory of old and paste to location on new.  This fakes out new to thinking Local is already established even though new install on new machine Local is not an option.  It's a backdoor.  If I did it.  U can 2  Permalink   Leave Tamper Protection Off until after you Log back in to new.  If you do not see password bar for Local Password with small option to Open Cloud Vault .  It didn't work.  If it did watch for prompts to Go Cloud and don't. 
 

Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Yes. Same password as the one you copied. When you Log off/Log on then Norton sees the files you copied and then knows it has a Local Vault.

Jim

Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

First you Log on to your computer, use what you want in Windows to copy the files. Then Log off your computer and Log back in.

Jim

Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Ok...I see now, I think. I am the only user on the old and new systems so I did not bother with a password to log into Windows.

If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is!
Kudos3 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

I just wanted to update everyone that this worked well with NS 22.1.0.9. I installed it on my New Build system with 64 bit Win8.1 Pro and all works OK! I did NOT want to go to the Cloud.

If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is!
Kudos1 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Thanks for the feedback MPSAN and glad all is fine!

Kudos1 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Yes, I wanted to let people know that this is still a good option. Just be careful of the steps you take and you will be OK!

If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is!
Kudos1 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

MPSAN:

Yes, I wanted to let people know that this is still a good option. Just be careful of the steps you take and you will be OK!

My Local is working without a hitch since Permalink
 Remember, don't tell Norton.  

Kudos1 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

OH, I would never tell Norton, but I may tell Norton that the file in /latestns is NOT the latest version!

If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is!
Kudos1 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

UPDATE!!  This saved my butt!!

All was good when I put NS on my new system with no previous AV. So I did copy the 3 files. OK, as I said above all worked!

BUT, being confident that NS was OK, I then went to my XP system and installed NS over NIS2014. It then wanted me to login as I had no vault! Sure enough, it removed the files from the directory on my XP system. I still had the files on my USB drive (and even on an image I made before the upgrade) and I followed the above and it worked! I never thought that the upgrade would require this same procedure but it worked!

If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is!
Kudos1 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Awesome work everyone.

Just did fresh install of Win 7 on new SSD. I installed NSWB and tried to transfer my local vault. I needed Phoneman's advice here, to realize how this will work. I had already opened my online vault, and could not get the local to open. Uninstalled NSWB and started again, but did not open the cloud. This time the transfer worked perfectly.

Things happen. Export/Backup your Norton Password Manager data.
Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Thanks for the feedback peterweb and glad to hear things went smoothly (more or less) for you.

Great advice for anyone doing this PhoneMan, thanks once again - hopefully it will assist others.

Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Thank you. This actually worked. It is a shame on Norton that outside groups can offer better support than the Norton "specialists" . These instructions got me up and running.

Again, thank you.

Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Hello The Bob

Everyone posting in this Forum are Norton users of the various products. Norton Employees do sometimes post in the Forum also. They have red tags by their names. We are not outside groups of people. We are actually use the products, so that sometimes helps. We are usually some what familiar with our own computers. The Norton techs are coming into a computer which might have a different setup than they are used to so that might make it more difficult when they try to offer support. This is just my opinion.

Success always occurs in private and failure in full view. Windows 7 Pro 64 bit NSBU 22.17.0.183 Core Firmware 270 I E 11 Chrome latest one
Kudos2 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

This is a fabulous tutorial and I offer kudos to elsewhere for researching and composing it along with members PRIOR and PhoneMan for testing the procedure!

I used this method yesterday when performing a clean install from NISv20 to Norton Security with Backup v22.  Following the instructions as outlined, I was able to successfully create a local vault on a fresh installation of NSwBU.

All of my logins were preserved and identity Safe was able to populate the proper fields on various websites. However, inserting my existing favicon folder did not yield any favicons for the logins, nor were any generated when the folder was removed. Unfortunately I encountered two side effects which concern me.

When ID Safe is ENABLED in Settings, the memory usage/allocation of NSwBU spikes once I go online. The two images below demonstrate the difference as reported in Process Explorer.  

(Columns: PID   CPU   Private Bytes   Working Set)

You will note that when ID Safe is DISABLED in settings, the stats for NSwBU when I am online are quite acceptable. However when I go online with ID Safe ENABLED, Private Bytes spikes by a factor of eight and remains that way even once the browser is closed. The same result is observed regardless of which browser is used.

The second issue is that when ID Safe is ENABLED and I have been online, my computer cold startup time more than doubles from 1:42 to 3:36.  With ID Safe DISABLED, my startup time returns back to the normal 1:42.

As previously mentioned, this was a clean install of NSwBU. I first uninstalled NISv20, then used the Norton Removal Tool and followed that by a search and deletion of all Norton/Symantec folders and files. The installation of NSwBU went smoothly and live updates were performed over the next few hours (no rush) before attempting to reinstate the ID Safe data. I am very satisfied with the performance of NSwBU on this laptop except for the ID Safe problem.

Due to these issues along with some other problems I have previously posted about the new ID Safe, I will be returning to a third-party password manager. Please do not interpret this as Norton-bashing, but rather an expression of extreme disappointment in the overall changes to ID Safe. Prior to NIS v21, ID safe worked very well and was the greatest thing since sliced bread.

This may be unique to my machine but if anyone else is seeing similar issues when using ID Safe, it would be great to see that information posted in this thread for comparison.

For those whom ID Safe is working well, I am happy for you - enjoy!

Again, thanks to elsewhere, PRIOR and PhoneMan for their work in creating this procedure.  I'm sure many members will find it useful.

Windows 7 Professional x64  NSwBU v22.1.0.9

"Anyone who isn't confused really doesn't understand the situation."   Edward R. Murrow
Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Hi Phil,

I did not check the cold boot time, but I did play with the Settings for ID Safe and looked at Process Explorer.

(Columns: PID   CPU   Private Bytes   Working Set)

I notice no CPU's listed (although selected), but seem to see different results than you do.  I am running Process Explorer 9.0 is that current?  I am not an avid user of PE, so I could be doing something wrong. BTW, I was logged into my ID Safe when it was on.

I am on Win 7 Home x64 NSBU v22.1.0.9

FWIW, I have both Local and Online Vaults on my system.

Sorry if this is not much help Phil.

Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Hi yank,

Thank you for taking the time to post your findings; the information is very useful.  In my opinion the Private Bytes running at 179,428K and 161,924K are way too high.  In previous Norton versions even with ID Safe turned on, I don't recall seeing numbers this high and never for sustained periods. 

The image below shows my status right now - online with a third-party password manager engaged.  Quite a difference from your numbers.

(Columns: PID   CPU   Private Bytes   Working Set)

Just one question, when you turned off ID Safe, did you restart or shutdown your machine prior to taking the screenshot?  I think that is required to fully 'unload' the ID Safe app.

"Anyone who isn't confused really doesn't understand the situation."   Edward R. Murrow
Kudos1 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Phil,

Went back and got the following - with a shutdown after changing the ID Safe setting:

It does appear to make a difference with the shutdown after changing settings.

BTW, I did time the boot time after the shutdown with ID setting ON and with ID setting OFF and they are very close (within 4 secs on my stopwatch) to the same on my system.  FWIW, I did notice the Norton Icon appear more quickly in the system tray with ID Safe On. Boot Time Protection set to aggressive in both cases.

Hope that helps you some.

Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Thanks for the additional info.  ID Safe does seem to use/allocate quite a bit of memory.

Interesting how you have the Norton icon beside both nsbu.exe entries.  I only have the one and checking my wife's laptop, she also only has the single icon.
 

"Anyone who isn't confused really doesn't understand the situation."   Edward R. Murrow
Kudos0

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Phil_D:

[...]

When ID Safe is ENABLED in Settings, the memory usage/allocation of NSwBU spikes once I go online. The two images below demonstrate the difference as reported in Process Explorer.  

(Columns: PID   CPU   Private Bytes   Working Set)

You will note that when ID Safe is DISABLED in settings, the stats for NSwBU when I am online are quite acceptable. However when I go online with ID Safe ENABLED, Private Bytes spikes by a factor of eight and remains that way even once the browser is closed. The same result is observed regardless of which browser is used.

The second issue is that when ID Safe is ENABLED and I have been online, my computer cold startup time more than doubles from 1:42 to 3:36.  With ID Safe DISABLED, my startup time returns back to the normal 1:42.

[...]

 Hi Phil_D

Thanks for your feedback. I still would have preferred it if Option 1 would have been implemented though. This workaround (Option 2) however, gives Norton users the Local Vault choice that they have been looking for.

Regarding the "Private Bytes" memory usage reported by Process Explorer above, I saw similar results on my Windows 7 64 machine. However, on closer inspection, the "Private Bytes" value turned out to something I didn't initially expect:

"Private Bytes" represents Virtual Memory usage whereas "Working Set" represents Physical Memory usage. Given the similarity of the "Working Set" physical memory usage values between the Identity Safe On and Off scenarios, would you still consider this to be an issue?

Regarding issue 2 (cold boot start-up times), do you have Boot Time Protection set to Aggressive (as per yank's suggestion)?

Kudos1 Stats

Re: Retaining your Local Vault

Hi elsewhere,

First, let me say again that your tutorial is excellent and provides easy methods by which Norton users can retain a local vault.  I commend you on your work and I'm sure it has proven valuable to many Norton users.

There seem to be a number of opinions about Private Bytes and Working set.  Many experts define Private Bytes as the current size in bytes of memory that a process has allocated that cannot be shared with other processes and "is a reliable indicator of a leak in the application memory space."
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1984186/what-is-private-bytes-virtual-bytes-working-set

As to the cold boot start-up times, I started with the Boot Time Protection set at default, Off and then checked using Normal and Aggressive. None of these improved the boot time.

So, when I include the memory issues, the extended boot time, the lack of ID Safe folders and the unwieldy ID Safe app, the new version of ID Safe is just not for me anymore.  As mentioned, I used ID Safe for many years and thought it was the greatest product of its type.  But when features no longer suit your needs and detract from the user experience, it's time to move on.

However, none of this is meant to detract from your valuable tutorial.  I can attest that it works as advertised and I'm sure will be beneficial to many.  You did a great job!

"Anyone who isn't confused really doesn't understand the situation."   Edward R. Murrow

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