Optimization doesn't fully defragment

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Jeff,

 

It may take several times to defragment a 250gb drive, although I find it curious that it only gained 2% after optimization. When you ran the windows xp defragment, did it tell you in the report which were the most offending files?

 

Matt

I have had to run the Norton Optimization program (defrag) up to 3 times, on the large disks.

 

I ran the process four times, with no better results.  The last two times took less than 30 seconds.

The report from Windows defrag showed only 3 files as the "most fragmented", consuming 7.6GB but having only a total of 535 fragments.  Here are the gory details:

Volume DSK1_VOL1 (C:)
    Volume size                                = 233 GB
    Cluster size                               = 4 KB
    Used space                                 = 184 GB
    Free space                                 = 49.29 GB
    Percent free space                         = 21 %

Volume fragmentation
    Total fragmentation                        = 44 %
    File fragmentation                         = 88 %
    Free space fragmentation                   = 0 %

File fragmentation
    Total files                                = 45,009
    Average file size                          = 5 MB
    Total fragmented files                     = 62
    Total excess fragments                     = 594
    Average fragments per file                 = 1.01

Pagefile fragmentation
    Pagefile size                              = 1.50 GB
    Total fragments                            = 1

Folder fragmentation
    Total folders                              = 3,923
    Fragmented folders                         = 1
    Excess folder fragments                    = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
    Total MFT size                             = 51 MB
    MFT record count                           = 49,562
    Percent MFT in use                         = 94 %
    Total MFT fragments                        = 3

It seems weird to have 88% file fragmentation, yet only 62 fragmented files.

 

Hi JeffG,

 

Which files are the 3 gross offenders? Are you able to find out which specific files they are? Thanks! 

Tony,

They were all .mpg files.  This machine is my home-built DVR.  I viewed and deleted two of them (and several others that didn't appear on the list), but the issue persists.

 

This machine runs only a public-domain TV recording program (GBPVR) and some other ancillary programs (a clock syncing program that runs every 4 hours, a bluetooth keyboard/mouse, Nero 7), and Norton 360,

 

Thanks again for your interest.  Here is the latest dump of the Disk Defragmenter, including the "most fragmented files" list.  Note that the report says that free space fragmentation is zero, yet the graphic representation in the Disk Defragmenter window shows no significant contiguous free space, just thin red and white bars all the way from left to right (OK, there are occasional blue bars - but most of them are at the left).

Volume DSK1_VOL1 (C:)
    Volume size                                = 233 GB
    Cluster size                               = 4 KB
    Used space                                 = 155 GB
    Free space                                 = 77.61 GB
    Percent free space                         = 33 %

Volume fragmentation
    Total fragmentation                        = 45 %
    File fragmentation                         = 91 %
    Free space fragmentation                   = 0 %

File fragmentation
    Total files                                = 44,795
    Average file size                          = 4 MB
    Total fragmented files                     = 74
    Total excess fragments                     = 418
    Average fragments per file                 = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
    Pagefile size                              = 1.50 GB
    Total fragments                            = 1

Folder fragmentation
    Total folders                              = 3,922
    Fragmented folders                         = 1
    Excess folder fragments                    = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
    Total MFT size                             = 51 MB
    MFT record count                           = 49,265
    Percent MFT in use                         = 94 %
    Total MFT fragments                        = 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments       File Size       Most fragmented files
157             1.72 GB         \Documents and Settings\Jeff\My Documents\My Videos\The Jewish Americans\The Jewish Americans_20080110_02000400.mpg
58              0 bytes         \Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Symantec\SRTSP\SrtETmp\6F855723.TMP
53              3 MB            \Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Symantec\LiveUpdate\Settings.LiveUpdate
53              3 MB            \Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Symantec\LiveUpdate\Settings.LastGood.LiveUpdate
7               192 KB          \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\FQ86IB75\lia-scripts-min[1].js
5               32 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\ntuser.dat.LOG
5               67 KB           \Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Symantec\LiveUpdate\History.LiveUpdate
5               78 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\8ZSN27DQ\1969577859[1].css
5               123 KB          \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\8ZSN27DQ\prototype[1].js
4               63 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\Z2OLA5IA\lia-scripts-min[1].js
4               63 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\Z2OLA5IA\symantec[1].css
4               60 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\Z2OLA5IA\jspellEvolution[1].js
4               58 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\Z2OLA5IA\headerjs[1].htm
3               29 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\FQ86IB75\symantec[1].js
3               25 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\Z2OLA5IA\4734[1].htm
2               2 MB            \Program Files\Norton 360\Log\CUInternetTempFiles.log
2               32 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\History\History.IE5\MSHist012008100320081004\index.dat
2               64 KB           \WINDOWS\SoftwareDistribution\DataStore\Logs\tmp.edb
2               8 KB            \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\11UVYI49\editor_ui[1].css
2               15 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\8ZSN27DQ\s_code[1].js
2               11 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\11UVYI49\dom-min[1].js
2               6 KB            \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\8ZSN27DQ\yahoo-min[1].js
2               16 KB           \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Local Settings\Temp\~DF95E8.tmp
2               4 KB            \Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Symantec\LiveUpdate\2008-10-03_Log.ALUSchedulerSvc.LiveUpdate
2               5 KB            \Documents and Settings\Jeff\Desktop\VolumeC.txt
2               1 KB            \Documents and Settings\Administrator\ntuser.dat.LOG

You sure your running defrag with admin privilages?

Fair question, and thanks for your interest.  The answer is, Yes.  There is only one User Account set up on this machine and it has administrator privileges (confirmed in the User Accounts option in Control Panel).

For the record, and in case it matters, here are some specs:

 

Motherboard: ASUS A8N-SLI Premium

Processor: AMD Athlon 64 3000+

RAM: 2GB

Video: NVidea GeForce 6600 LE  (256MB RAM)

Hard disk: Seagate ST3250623A   (250GB PATA)

Keyboard/Mouse: Logitech diNovo Edge   (bluetooth, and it rocks!)

OS: MS Windows XP Pro, SP3

 

You could try and run the Windows defrag utility to see if you get any different results, I would suspect not.

 

Right click the drive in question

Select properties

Select "Tools" tab

click Defragment Now...

 

Matt

2 Likes

Matt, the listings above are from the Windows defrag utility.  The latest run resulted in this data:

Volume DSK1_VOL1 (C:)
    Volume size                                = 233 GB
    Cluster size                               = 4 KB
    Used space                                 = 134 GB
    Free space                                 = 98.52 GB
    Percent free space                         = 42 %

Volume fragmentation
    Total fragmentation                        = 43 %
    File fragmentation                         = 87 %
    Free space fragmentation                   = 0 %

File fragmentation
    Total files                                = 45,777
    Average file size                          = 3 MB
    Total fragmented files                     = 33
    Total excess fragments                     = 33
    Average fragments per file                 = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
    Pagefile size                              = 1.50 GB
    Total fragments                            = 1

Folder fragmentation
    Total folders                              = 4,002
    Fragmented folders                         = 1
    Excess folder fragments                    = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
    Total MFT size                             = 51 MB
    MFT record count                           = 50,394
    Percent MFT in use                         = 96 %
    Total MFT fragments                        = 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments       File Size       Files that cannot be defragmented
None

Things that look strange to me:

o The disk is 42% free, yet 43% fragmented, while free space fragmentation is 0%. The Norton 360 disk optimization utility echoes the 43% fragmented value, before and after optimization.

o Free space fragmentation is 0%, yet the graphic representation of disk space usage in the defrag utilty still looks like a Christmas candy cane, all red/white (fragmented/free) stripes.  I would expect to see a large area of white, representing unfragmented free space.

o Total fragmented file count is 33, and the Total excess fragment count is also 33, yet the disk is 43% fragmented. 

 

Any thoughts on these apparent inconsistencies?
 

Because of SymProtect Tamper Protection, Windows may not be permitted access to Norton related files. Also, when running any defrag, make sure that there are no other programs running and any other malware protection is disabled.

Thanks for your thoughts, TechOutsider.  While I have no control over when the automatic Norton 360 defrags occur, I have closed all running programs when I manually run the optimizer or the Windows defrag utility.

 

I'm starting to wonder if there might be something wrong with the file system.  Maybe NTFS is reporting incorrect information?  Then again, I've noticed no issues with running programs, only that the fragmentation percentage won't go below 42%.  I guess I'll keep working on watching (then deleting) all the sports events I've recorded, to free up more space-- though one would think that 100GB of unused space would be enough to build contiguous files -- or contiguous free space for that matter.

Disable Norton 360 protection and disconnect from the internet, then defrag. Norton has control of quite a bit of files on your system.

Thanks, Tech0utsider.  Unfortunately, I didn't have the chance to try your suggestion, as I ran another defrag utility that successfully collected the file fragments on my disk.  It took more than two hours to do it, but now both 360 and the Windows defrag utility report 0% fragmentation.

 

At this point, I don't think that there is anything else that can be done to diagnose my issue, so I'll just say "Thank you" to all who offered their suggestions, and move on from here.

 

Jeff

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