NIS LiveUpdate causing dial-up disconnects?

Norton Security | Norton Internet Security
1

Unfortunately I am limited at home to dial-up for now and in the immediate future. For

larger downloads (like Windows 7 updates) I use a library wi-fi. A little inconvenient at

times but it works.

 

A large LiveUpdate (103M or so) came up for download on my NIS-2011 so I
went to the library to do the download (Jan. 7, 2012). Computer went unused until Jan. 9

when I immediately started having trouble with the dial-up line disconnecting at random

times (from a few minutes to about 25 minutes max per connection). I checked back and

forth with another home computer running Win98 and did not have this problem. The only

time I've ever had any disconnect problem was when there was a storm or something and

that was not the case. Also am using "Never dial a connection" and idle time is set

sufficiently high.

 

Went to the library wi-fi Jan. 10 to research this problem a bit and found I could upgrade

to 2012 Version 19.2.0.10. I did so. I also updated the modem driver. The updated

modem driver is dated "10/26/2009" so I'm not sure it really changed this driver at all.

Upon returning home I found the disconnect problem had disappeared! It is OK as of this post.

 

Checking for Norton LiveUpdates back home with Version 19.2.0.10 installed I found yet another large

LiveUpdate (93M or so) waiting for me and now am afraid to download it as that

disconnect problem might return with the new LiveUpdate. I am currently leaving the

AutoLiveUpdate OFF for now.

 

Before I run that LiveUpdate again at the library wi-fi I will do a full Windows back-up

(which I always do prior to downloading Windows 7 Updates).

 

Now, if that persistent disconnect problem recurrs which might I do first:

 

1) Restore the full backup using Windows backup made just prior to doing the

LiveUpdate? Will there be any problems re-starting NIS when you restore a backup?

2) Uninstall then re-install 19.2.0.10 by itself?

3) Other procedure or test to recommend before doing 1) or 2)?

 

Any reason why an installed LiveUpdate could cause such a problem? Is there any way of

uninstalling a given LiveUpdate (like you can with Win7 updates)? Can you find out the

filenames/sizes of files downloaded (or to be downloaded) during a given LiveUpdate

session (like you can with Win7 updates)?

 

Any assistance would be appreciated.

Thanks
Karl

2

Hi Dick

 

(your comments in italics - sorry, I’ve been away from “boards” for quite some time so I can be slow! )

 

How are your update settings? Open NIS click on settings then click on updates on the computer screen. The first three should be off [red] and the last one green This should keep the calls home by the program to a minimum.

 

Right now they are ALL OFF. I will turn on the Smart Definitions and check for any disconnect problems after I backup.

 

It also means that the trips to the library are going to be a necessity to keep everything current.. MS like to release their updates on Tuesdays so if you make your trip after that you can get both MS and Norton updated in a single trip.

 

I usually update NIS every day and the downloads are usually 5M or less and not a problem. I usually run applicable MS updates once a month minimum at the library on a Thursday. Right now I think I’ll let the MS updates go until later.

 

When you do a backup/restore of the operating system you will change a number of the Norton settings which will require you to do a control panel uninstall and reinstall of the program.

 

Not sure what you mean by that or how you do this. Isn’t that "control panel" restored as a normal part of the Windows restore operation?

 

ALSO be sure you save your identity safe data to a location that will not get lost in the restore.

 

OK

 

I don't think there's a direct link between NIS and the disconnect.

 

Neither do I, but the problem occurred immediately after that big download and that’s all I have to go on for now.

 

Sorry. Liveupdate has been integrated into the program so it is no longer a separate module you can delete.

 

Thought so but doesn’t hurt to ask!

 

I probably won’t get to that download test until next week sometime. I just want to be super careful for now while my connection is OK!

 

Thanks for all

 

Karl

3
Karl_G wrote:
Also am using "Never dial a connection" and idle time is set sufficiently high...Can you find out the filenames/sizes of files downloaded (or to be downloaded) during a given LiveUpdate session (like you can with Win7 updates)?

 

Hi Karl_G:

 

When you say that "idle time is set sufficiently high", do you mean the disconnect time setting on your dial-up modem?  I have a dial-up conection at home as well and you might find some helpful information about dial-up modems and LiveUpdates in aggrevated1's thread here titled Norton AntiVirus 2011 Won't Complete Updates.  My Automatic LiveUpdates are currently turned off and I run a manual LiveUpdate once a day, preferably over a public WiFi connection just in case a large product update (> 30 MB) is scheduled for delivery.

 

Older Norton products used to list the name and file size of each available update in a pop-up window prior to the start of LiveUpdate downloads, and users had the ability to decline (deselect) larger or non-critical updates. When pulse updates were introduced a few years ago, Symantec eliminated that level of control so that users with faster Internet connections wouldn't see a pop-up notification every time an Automatic LiveUpdate ran in the background.  I still use NIS 2011 but I understand that dial-up users can use the new Metered Bandwidth feature in 2012 Norton products to control how background tasks like LiveUpdates run on their dial-up connections (see michaell's comments here).

 

Edit:

 

And regarding your questions about re-installing NIS after a system restore, these system restores are really intended to fix problems with corrupted Windows system files and registry entries and it's very common for third-party software like NIS to be corrupted when entries in the Windows registry are rolled back to a previous date.  Users often find that their Norton products behave erratically and have to be re-installed using the Norton Removal Tool (see instructions here for NIS) after a system restore.

-----------

Windows Vista Home Premium 32-bit SP2 * NIS 2011 v. 18.6.0.29 * IE 9.0 * Firefox 9.0.1
HP Pavilion dv6835ca, Intel Core2Duo CPU T5550 @ 1.83 GHz, 3.0 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400M GS

4

Unfortunately I am limited at home to dial-up for now and in the immediate future. For

larger downloads (like Windows 7 updates) I use a library wi-fi. A little inconvenient at

times but it works.

 

A large LiveUpdate (103M or so) came up for download on my NIS-2011 so I
went to the library to do the download (Jan. 7, 2012). Computer went unused until Jan. 9

when I immediately started having trouble with the dial-up line disconnecting at random

times (from a few minutes to about 25 minutes max per connection). I checked back and

forth with another home computer running Win98 and did not have this problem. The only

time I've ever had any disconnect problem was when there was a storm or something and

that was not the case. Also am using "Never dial a connection" and idle time is set

sufficiently high.

 

Went to the library wi-fi Jan. 10 to research this problem a bit and found I could upgrade

to 2012 Version 19.2.0.10. I did so. I also updated the modem driver. The updated

modem driver is dated "10/26/2009" so I'm not sure it really changed this driver at all.

Upon returning home I found the disconnect problem had disappeared! It is OK as of this post.

 

Checking for Norton LiveUpdates back home with Version 19.2.0.10 installed I found yet another large

LiveUpdate (93M or so) waiting for me and now am afraid to download it as that

disconnect problem might return with the new LiveUpdate. I am currently leaving the

AutoLiveUpdate OFF for now.

 

Before I run that LiveUpdate again at the library wi-fi I will do a full Windows back-up

(which I always do prior to downloading Windows 7 Updates).

 

Now, if that persistent disconnect problem recurrs which might I do first:

 

1) Restore the full backup using Windows backup made just prior to doing the

LiveUpdate? Will there be any problems re-starting NIS when you restore a backup?

2) Uninstall then re-install 19.2.0.10 by itself?

3) Other procedure or test to recommend before doing 1) or 2)?

 

Any reason why an installed LiveUpdate could cause such a problem? Is there any way of

uninstalling a given LiveUpdate (like you can with Win7 updates)? Can you find out the

filenames/sizes of files downloaded (or to be downloaded) during a given LiveUpdate

session (like you can with Win7 updates)?

 

Any assistance would be appreciated.

Thanks
Karl

5

Hi Imacri

 

I have my dial-up modem idle time set at 20min and could set it longer but most often I am using a site that updates itself every minute or so and its never idle for long when I’m connected anyway.

 

Thanks for all the nice info. I copied all those referenced threads for further reading. I downloaded the Norton Removal Tool but the NIS Online Installer is 105M and that’s a library trip. I’ll do that before I run that big update. The instructions provided seem clear cut and I can understand the potential conflict with Windows.

 

I found that “Metered Bandwidth” feature. I just downloaded the 2012 version so I am still exploring the new menus! Yes, I usually run LiveUpdate every day and if the download size is unmanageable I will just cancel and do it later - at least I find out the size involved.

 

Thanks again

 

Karl_G

6
Karl_G wrote:

 

Now, if that persistent disconnect problem recurrs which might I do first:

 

1) Restore the full backup using Windows backup made just prior to doing the LiveUpdate? Will there be any problems re-starting NIS when you restore a backup?


Hi Karl_G:

 

When you asked about restoring a "full backup using Windows backup"  in message # 1 , were you referring to restoring your computer from a system image backup (see Microsoft support article here).  A  system image is an exact copy of your hard drive, and restoring from a system image shouldn't cause major problems with NIS (at least in theory) as long as you remember to re-set your system clock and peform a few re-boots and LiveUpdates to get your NIS virus definitions back up-to-date.

 

The re-install of NIS that dickevans referred to in message # 2 might only be necessary if you performed a Windows System Restore using one of the "partial" system restore points  that are automatically created by your Windows OS.

 

For future reference, if you ever need to perform a system restore make sure that you completely shut down NIS first - especially the Norton Product Tamper Protection (Settings | Miscellaneous Settings | Product Security | Norton Product Tamper Protection) and real-time AntiVirus Auto-Protect features.   Security programs like NIS "hook" their services into the Windows operating system and if they aren't shut down before the system restore you run the risk of damaging your Windows system files.  Norton Product Tamper Protection is designed to protect your NIS from a virus or malware attack that could attempt to shut down your antivirus protection, and this same tamper protection often prevents system restores from changing Norton files and registry entries and could interrupt the normal completion of the system restore.

--------

Windows Vista Home Premium 32-bit SP2 * NIS 2011 v. 18.6.0.29 * IE 9.0 * Firefox 9.0.1
HP Pavilion dv6835ca, Intel Core2Duo CPU T5550 @ 1.83 GHz, 3.0 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400M GS

7

Hi Karl,

 

Welcome to the Norton Community.

 

As stated by others NIS would not cause your modem to disconnect.

 

It sounds like your primary computer is Windows 7 but I am concerned because you also said "I checked back and forth with another home computer running Win98 and did not have this problem."

 

Do you then have another computer running Windows 98? Is this computer connected to the Internet also?

 

What security software does your Windows 98 computer have? Note that NIS 2012 does not support Windows 98. In fact the last product year version of NIS which does support Windows 98 is NIS 2005!

 

http://www.amazon.com/Norton-Internet-Security-2005-Single/dp/B0002UCSKI/ref=sr_1_1?s=software&ie=UTF8&qid=1326515570&sr=1-1

 

Also, Microsoft no longer supports Windows 98 - it was end of lifed back in July 2006.

 

http://support.microsoft.com/gp/lifean18

 

There are also no further security updates or anything for Windows 98.

 

Best wishes.

Allen

8

Karl,

You said

"

When you do a backup/restore of the operating system you will change a number of the Norton settings which will require you to do a control panel uninstall and reinstall of the program.

 

Not sure what you mean by that or how you do this. Isn’t that "control panel" restored as a normal part of the Windows restore operation?"

 

OK, whe you restore the operating system to an earlier date - usually before a problem started - it copies back all of your files and the dates on them will be the date when the backup was made. With your Norton product as one of those files the dates on the restored files will not be the same as the file dates they are replacing. This will cause consequences when Norton tries to do an update. The control panel uninstall and reinstall will revise the dates so that live update will be able to do its thing correctly.

Maybe this will help. The program on your computer should be the Norton installer. The date on it isn't as important as the dates on the program files. When you reinstall your Norton program using the installer it copies the files from the Norton server and they get fresh dates on your computer.

Hope this helps

9

Hi Imacri

 

You wrote:

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For future reference, if you ever need to perform a system restore make sure that you completely shut down NIS first - especially the Norton Product Tamper Protection (Settings | Miscellaneous Settings | Product Security | Norton Product Tamper Protection) and realtime AntiVirus Auto-Protect features. Security programs like NIS "hook" their services into the Windows operating system and if theyaren't shut down before the system restore you run the risk of damaging your Windows system files. Norton Product Tamper Protection isdesigned to protect your NIS from a virus or malware attack that could attempt to shut down your antivirus protection, and this sametamper protection often prevents system restores from changing Norton files and registry entries and could interrupt the normal completion of the system restore.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

Should all of this be done prior to FULL BACKUP(with system image) also? I would assume so. I probably won’t be backing up until tomorrow or Tuesday. I had done a Windows full backup(with system image)/restore last year sometime and used the standard Microsoft settings. All went smooth. Dial up has been operating just fine right now with all NIS Live/Pulse updates, downloads and Smart Definitions OFF.

 

Thanks

 

Karl

10

Hi Allen

You wrote:

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Do you then have another computer running Windows 98? Is this computer connected to the Internet also?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I use the Win98 computer VERY RARELY on the internet, only in an emergency or something. I am aware of the loss of all support years ago. I have and am using whatever the last Norton update was for the 2005 version of NIS.

 

I primarily use that Win98 computer with an HP DJ1000Cse printer because I really like it for certain print jobs. I have some trouble communicating with that printer with this newer laptop but that’s another issue for another day!

 

Thanks

 

Karl

11

Hi Dick

You wrote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

OK, whe you restore the operating system to an earlier date - usually before a problem started - it copies back all of your files and the dates on them will be the date when the backup was made. With your Norton product as one of those files the dates on the restored files will not be the same as the file dates they are replacing. This will cause consequences when Norton tries to do an update. The control panel uninstall and reinstall will revise the dates so that live update will be able to do its thing correctly.

Maybe this will help. The program on your computer should be the Norton installer. The date on it isn't as important as the dates on the program files. When you reinstall your Norton program using the installer it copies the files from the Norton server and they get fresh dateson your computer.

 

Hope this helps

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes this does help - thanks!

 

I will download the NIS uninstaller/installer and use it if everything gets that far.

 

Karl

12

Hello All

 

So far so good. Went to that library on Jan 17 and downloaded the NIS offline installer for future possible use. Then went to update the 2012 NIS and to my surprise there was no large (100M or so) file download waiting! There were 9 files @ about 5M. I checked for updates several times after ( hard reboot each time) and only got one further small 2 file download.

 

At home I have since had no problem with any line disconnects after many hours online with NIS 2012 auto LiveUpdate and new version download OFF and Smart Definitions either OFF or ON. I have since run about 12 different manual updates with no problems.

 

Since things are OK for now I’m going to run with this as is. Why the problem occurred I doubt if the reason can be found. One difference is that I am now using NIS2012. It might be that the original large update (103M) mentioned in my first post possibly had files compatible only with NIS2012 and not with the NIS2011 that I was using at the time. Just speculating though.

 

Thanks to all for exposing me to the NRT, offline installer and their use. There is some nice info for me to explore in the other threads and will be back here if there are further disconnect problems.

Karl

13

Hi Karl,

 

Thanks for the update. Just one word of caution, I would recommend that you not change the Smart Definition setting as this by itself should trigger the need to download the full definition set consistent with that setting.

 

Best wishes.

Allen

14

Hi Allen

 

Yes the Smart Definitions will be ON always as per Norton default.

 

Thanks

 

Karl