Norton Stopped working and will not re-install - Dell XPS8940 Windows 11

Archive
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Headline: - I am unable to re-install Norton.

PC: - Dell XPS8940 Running Windows 11 Pro v 21H2.

Details:

Some slightly odd behaviour of the PC lately (false positives on the Dell-installed features) led me to realise that Windows Defender had started operating instead of Norton 360. Norton 360 refused to respond to clicks on its desktop icon. There had been no false positives when Norton was ooperating the security.

Yesterday when I logged in to and looked at my Norton dashboard it showed that it believed the PC to be offline since 9 days ago and protected.

Various searches of the Support pages told me that a re-installation is required.

Removal of Norton 360 with the Norton RnR tool worked fine, but installation didn't. The installation tool (in Administrator mode) would start, then install scanner, download virus signatures, then scan for viruses. Next it would show the message "Device Security - installing" for a couple of seconds, then go in to the Error Log routine. It seems to generate 4 sets of logs to be sent to Norton.

The Norton Power Eraser doesn't find any problems, and sends me back to installation.

The installation fails as described above.

I have removed Malwarebyte, and still no difference.

I have removed CCleaner, and still no difference.

Today, after finding the same issues I have tried to install Norton in Windows "Safe Mode with Network" but still no change to the installation, although Norton Power Eraser seems to hang in this mode when it gets to the reboot part.

Is there something I need to do to the Norton installer, or do I need to go for re-installation of Win 11? Everything else on the PC seems to work fine so that is rather drastic, considering that Windows Defender seems to have come to the rescue for the time being. The fact that the Norton Dashboard tells me that the PC is still protected, but has now been offline for 10 days (as of today), rather points to finger at the Norton set up as being the problem.

 

 

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Update: As a test. Before installing a new SSD I removed Norton Security Ultra from my Windows 11 laptop with a remove only scenario, and rebooted. Then manually removed all folders left after the removal, and another reboot. I then downloaded and installed Norton 360 Deluxe on the machine. I got several patches, restarting manually as each one was separately installed. The product came to the current version of 22.22.4.11 . All my scan ran perfectly, no abnormal delays in the Norton UI opening. 

I then installed the NVME SSD, initialized it in disk management, performed a clean install of Windows 11 onto the SSD. Live updates on Windows 11 brought me to Windows 11 21H2 build 22000.675 which is the current version. I then installed Norton 360 Deluxe using the same license seat as the previous install, removing it from the subscription. N360 Deluxe on Windows 11 is now version 22.22.4.11. NO ISSUES noted. I have ZERO OEM junk software on the computer. The SSD is managed by WD Dashboard as a separate application directly from WD. Noted during the clean install of Win 11 an HP firmware update also installed which updated the system BIOS. No issues with the OS nor N360 noted. The original HD is still on the system fully wiped clean and formatted for storage. Microsoft activated the new install without issue. 

Also noted: There are Defender settings in Windows 11 itself that can conflict. I disabled most of them after finding them enabled even after N360 completely installed and updated. 

https://allthings.how/how-to-enable-or-disable-microsoft-defender-in-windows-11/

 

SA

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FWIW!! I have a relatively new Dell laptop which also had "Dell Support Assist OS Recovery". I removed that trash literally the day I set it up, along with all the other Dell update software. Along the line the Dell support assistant was being seen in NIST with vulnerabilities, the suggestions were to upgrade and update the BIOS. I elected to update the BIOS to keep it secured and went against reinstalling the Dell trash ware. I haven't had any issues with it, its of course on Windows 10 Pro vice Windows 11 as in your case. 

I will still remove my current Norton install from my Win 11 machine and try installing N 360 Deluxe as promised. Things are busy my side with spring yardwork and that all to familiar "Hunny-Do-List" lol. Hoping to have the info posted here soon so we can validate whether something is specific to your system and OEM or a larger, broader issue across the spectrum. I can wait for the SSD install a bit longer its not a big deal other than killer boot up times. " Life is a beach, and its always 5'o-clock somewhere". 

SA

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Hi SA,

 

No, I've never seen that error.

The first I knew that Norton wasn't running was when I kept getting message about a failure in 'Dell SupportAssist OS Recovery'  which (apparently) is an app which stores the settings and status of Win 11 and the Registry, so that a roll-back can be easily performed if there is a problem.

It seems that the failure of the app was caused by Defender flagging a false positive on one of the modules in the app.

That's when I went in to the Norton help pages, ran Norton RnR (Remove and Reinstall), and found it couldn't do the reinstallation part. That's where this thread starts!

The irony of the situation is that although 'Dell SupportAssist OS Recovery' is supposed to have created restore points to which I should be able to go back, none of the restore points remained from before the problem surfaced.

I wish you well with your proper clean install. My previous desktop was manufactured locally, and I was able to order it 'empty'. I separately purchased the DVD version of Win 7 Ultimate so that I had the physical installation disc. Ditto foe whichever office version was the latest back then (that PC is up to Office 2016 now).

I found that the way to get really fast boot-up and program opening was to install and run on SSD. Hopefully you'll find that too.

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Update: I've been on my Windows 11 machine today updating things. There are issues I noted with Microsoft Defender and the Smart App security I noted in my previous posting. They are embedded into Windows Security, under "App and Browser control", "reputation based protection" as shown in Windows 10. The names of these settings ARE different than Windows 10 but look in the same area for the settings. I couldn't get a decent screenshot as I haven't totally gotten the laptop completely setup to suit my needs yet. I disabled all of them which required a reboot. Noticed changes were: 1- Boot time decreased 90%, 2- Effectual opening of apps time from click to use improved 75% over the previous session. 

My notes are these Windows Security settings WERE the cause of my serious performance degradation coupled with a slow spinning HD. I also believe they may be the cause of your issue as well. Why? After the reboot I then noticed Norton was NOT loading in the system tray, nor were the usual processes loaded in Task Manager. After a 10 minute wait I closed the fix it interface that appeared when I manually started Norton via the desktop icon, it had given the preverbal errors 8504-101. I closed that screen as well and the Norton UI then appeared. Another restart was in order so I restarted. Norton functions correctly at this point.  Have YOU seen this 8504-101 error appear with your issues? I have a screenshot from my mobile device which wound up having the file too large for the usual post embedding. I zipped it and added it below so you can see what I am seeing. 

Edited: Later this evening I will be removing Norton Security Ultra and installing Norton 360 Deluxe on this machine in the attempt to duplicate the reinstallation issue you are having as well.

SA

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FWIW!! I'm awaiting the limited 90 day warranty to expire on my new HP laptop before putting N360 on. I will be replacing the antiquated 5400rpm HD with an 1 TB M.2 NVME SSD. So currently I cannot attest to what scenario is at hand other than with the NSU product I have installed. Thus far, Windows 11 isn't defaulting into any mode that isn't the defaults to disable defender with a 3rd party A/V solution installed. I also have seen past articles regarding Microsoft going the extra mile to force Windows Defender on Windows 11. Those links I do not have currently though. There are several modes for defender, and a 3rd party AV, depending on the OS involved as shown in this MS article. 

When I can install the NVME SSD I will be performing a CLEAN installation of Windows 11 without any of the OEM trash that is baked into a new factory build like HP, Dell and others. TPM, shouldn't prevent nor should the BIOS prevent installing the new drive in the absence of a factory image to look for. If that should be the case Houston has an issue. ( HP and Microsoft ) since the OS is registered to me under my MS account credentials. Wondering whether something in this article may have been applicable in your instance? I will look for this within my install as well then post here my findings. 

If you buy a new PC with Windows 11 pre-installed, Smart App Control will automatically be installed. 

SA

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Hi Peterweb,

Yes, the Dell bloatware included the McAfee AV product. I'm well used to getting rid of that item.

Something to watch out for - when Norton offers to sort out uninstalling the McAfee AV, the McAfee hides a dialogue box in a small pop-under, and Norton doesn't budge until I've found the pop-under and confirmed that McAfee deletion is required.

 

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One other thing to check. Did the Dell bloatware include any non Norton AV product trials? If so, you need to fully remove those using the removal tool for that product. 

 

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Hello SA,

It has been a few days since your last post, so here's what I have been doing.

First of all I followed your suggestion and created a new account with Administrative rights, and demoted the original account to Standard level. I uninstalled as much of the Dell stuff as I could find.

I tried several times to reinstall Norton through this new Admin account, but the result was still the same.

I noticed that some of the desktop program icons had reverted to the plain rectangle blank version rather than being their respective graphic icons; although they still correctly opened their programs. The icons in the taskbar and startup panel were still the correct graphic icons. One of those blank desktop icons was Google Earth, which had seemed to be often downloading upgrades. I decided to try uninstalling it, but found that not to be possible (neither with built-in Uninstaller nor with Revo) due to an msi file being missing. Eventually I removed it using a feature from the Microsoft site (click 'Download troubleshooter') designed to uninstall programs which suffer such loss. The Microsoft feature also repaired the Registry with regard to the GoogleEarth installation.

With Google Earth removed I again tried to reinstall Norton, but still no joy.

Next I uninstalled all the programs which displayed the blank desktop icons. Some went properly with Uninstall command, the others needed the Microsoft site feature.

Still Norton would not install.

Eventually I decided to take a hit and use the 'Reset PC' feature. This refreshed the C: drive Win 11 installation, while my data files D: drive were untouched. All my installed programs were removed - but when the Reset had completed all the Dell bloatware was back sad.

Norton then reinstalled correctly. My Dashboard now correctly shows this PC as online (it showed offline for 16 days immediately before the Reset).

It has taken a whole day to perform the Reset and to reinstall my programs (which aren't that many yet, the PC is only 3 months old). It isn't a decision to be taken lightly! Some of the programs needed to be re-pointed at the data in the D: drive, others found it again themselves. Although I had all the data already backed up off the PC anyway in several places (in case D: got wiped), I didn't think to back up by Browser Bookmarks (which included the link to this thread!).

I surmise that some corruption to the registry has occurred somewhere as indicated by the uninstallation via Microsoft Troubleshooter. I wonder if this was preventing the reinstallation of Norton?

 

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Try disabling all the Dell bloatware if any is still on the system. You also may want to create another separate admin account on the computer and log into it. Try to reinstall from that account. If successful your current main account has the apparent issue. 

SA

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Hello SA,

Yes, it is an Admin account.

I have found previously that Norton wouldn't let me do much other than scan in a Standard account (and I think that is indeed how it should be, so no complaints about that!).

David

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One small thing that sticks to my mind is whether you are logging into your computer under an admin account? 

SA

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Hello SoulAsylum,

Thank you for taking the time to reply. I understood clearly what you meant by just performing the remove part of Norton, RnR; that is something I had already attempted yesterday so your explaination was really clear.

Unfortunately there isn't a change to the problem. The installer goes from Installing Device Security to Scanning to Error Logs. Next it sends me to the Norton Power Eraser which finds nothing wrong, then back to the Installer and so on - with Restarts added in along the way.

If I go to the Norton Installation folder where the downloaded files have been put, and just run the DSP-N360-ESD-22.22.3.9-EN application, it does exactly the same, i.e. fails the installation.

I never get as far as completing the installation, so don't get to the part where I would have manually run live updates.

The Norton Dashboard still tells me that the PC is offline!

To check the Dashboard reporting feature, I fired up an older PC (Win 7) which was indicated as having a problem, and successfully updated its virus signatures. The Dashboard has correctly reported that the Win 7 PC has now no issues, is updated, was online (then) and is offline now.

Back to the Win 11 PC - I wonder now if I should try uninstalling the Norton files and manually removing them again (with the Restarts), plus in the Norton Dashboard remove this PC from the Licence, then re-install and re-register the PC?

There is a benefit already to me from your help so far - I was unaware of the fast startup feature. I will probably leave that switched off, so that each morning the PC starts operating from a known cold condition, rather than from a warm-start file which would be different after each shutdown.

David

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David please allow me to correct some outdated information in my last post. Please review and follow this article. The NR&R tool download link is also in the article for your use.

Use this article, follow the suggestions in step #5 where it states:

  • To only remove your Norton device security product, click Advanced Options and then click Remove Only.

Follow on screen prompts to restart your machine. Afterwards log into your Norton account to reinstall your Norton product and run live updates to install all patches that are available. Make sure you reboot as each patch is installed whether prompted to do so or not. This will ensure the patches are installed separately and completely. 

SA

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Hello David. First disable fast startup on your system. The setting being enabled can cause installation of software to fail. https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/4189-turn-off-fast-startup-windows-1...

 

Although you have already ran the tool, do so a second time, do a "removal only" scenario with the R&R tool. It may not find anything to remove but that would be normal as its good to recheck after disabling fast startup and proceed from there.

Run the Removal Tool, make sure you are logged into an account on your computer that has admin privileges. Perform a remove only scenario as instructed in this article using the portion labeled " I need help removing Norton". Reboot, manually find and remove ALL folders related to Norton , remove them and reboot again. THEN, reinstall your product by logging into your Norton account, download from there. Once the installer is completed, close your browser. Find and run the file you downloaded and install your product. When install is complete, manually run live updates and get any patches available. There will be several patches possible so get them one at a time and REBOOT when each one is installed whether instructed to or not. Finish getting any remaining updates, reboot yet again. Recheck for your issue and please let us know your results for follow-up!!

Edit: Updated hyperlink 

 

SA